Using writing, and meditation, and ice cream, and reading, and dreams,

and a whole lot of other tools to rediscover who I am,

after six years living with a man with OCPD.



Thursday, May 19, 2011

How Can I Deny Thee, OCPD?
Let Me Count The Ways

Catherine Zeta-Jones
via Wikimedia Commons
One of the most pernicious aspects of Obsessive-Compulsive Personality Disorder is the fact that those who have it are usually convinced there is nothing wrong with them. With those around them, sure.  They are surrounded by fools and incompetents!  

It's hard for any of us to admit that we might be mentally ill.  There's a big stigma (perhaps it should be called a Stinkma) about having any kind of mental disorder - except for perhaps the "cool" ones, like bi-polar disorder or anorexia.

Note: I am NOT saying it is "cool" to be bi-polar or have an eating disorder.  I know full well, the very deep pain and intense suffering that those with those diseases experience.  Still, the perception in the general public is that there are glamorous models, actors and actresses who have eating disorders, or who are receiving treatment for bi-polar disorder, or substance abuse.  So if these talented, beautiful people have a problem just like ours, it becomes a little easier to admit we suffer from it, too.

There are no "beautiful people" stepping forward and saying, "I have OCPD."  Many people have never even heard of OCPD.  Often, it's confused with OCD, or Asperger's, or autism, and what is true is that some people with OCPD also have some OCD or Asperger characteristics.  They may share a sensory overload with light, sounds, or odors, for example.  They may exhibit similar emotional "meltdowns" when something occurs they did not expect.

Many of the qualities of OCPD are extremely admirable, in small doses.  When cooking, we might not realize that we've added too much salt, but we sure know it when we taste it.  Way too much salt can make food not only unpleasant but inedible.

Here's an example: many women (and some men) with OCPD obsess over a clean house.  They are constantly cleaning, disinfecting, and bleaching things.  This might not seem so bad, until you hear stories about a woman who put so much bleach into her husband's laundry that he had to be medically treated for chemical burns in his crotch.  Twice.  Sometimes an OCPD woman (or man) is so wrapped up in obsessive cleaning 14 hours a day, 7 days a week, that there is no time to socialize with friends, play with the children, or go out to dinner with the spouse.

When partners, co-workers or children first hear about OCPD, there is a thrill of recognition, relief and hope.  This is what the problem is, I'm not going crazy after all, and now my partner/father/co-worker can get treated and things will be better.

Sometimes it works that way, but more often, the person with OCPD will deeply resent getting an amateur diagnosis from his loved one.  S/he will insist the partner is the one with the problem; will look up the condition online and point out triumphantly that s/he doesn't hoard, or obsess about being on time, so you see, s/he couldn't possibly have OCPD.  (Disregarding the other items that are spot-on.)

S/he may agree to go for counseling, and then:
  • Storm out because s/he doesn't like the things the counselor says.
  • Refuse to listen because s/he doesn't think the credentials of the counselor are impressive enough.
  • Listen but only hear part of what the counselor has to say.
  • Out and out reject a professional diagnosis of OCPD and a recommended course of behavior therapy.
The counselor, in turn, may not even use the term OCPD.  Because so many who have it react negatively to "labels," s/he may pussyfoot around, refer to "obsessive-compulsive tendencies" or "overwhelming anxiety."  So in some cases, denial may occur in part because the term OCPD was never officially used in the first place.  We can understand why a counselor might make that choice, because if a patient is willing to accept some therapy, sans label, it would seem better for their well-being than forcing a diagnosis on someone who will then abandon therapy altogether.

Here's some true stories (some details have been changed): 
I finally got my wife to read the book Too Perfect, and when she did she said wow and agreed that OCPD was her all the way. So much so that she actually made an appointment and has been going to a therapist. However,..... when I mention OCPD she gets upset and says not to label her. This coming from a woman who openly admitted that she could identify with the entire book.

My boyfriend knows he's OCPD but hates "labels" and denies having OCPD. When our therapist first brought it up and read the symptoms, I had my mouth hanging open and he had the BIGGEST smile on his face. He was proud!!   Now, he denies it (it's like talking to a crazy person!) and he gets upset whenever i bring it up.

My OCPD wife went to joint counseling last year on threat of separation. When she was diagnosed with OCPD, she didn't accept it and we came to an impasse.

My husband actually found out about OCPD on his own 2 years ago, then made an appointment with a psychiatrist who officially diagnosed him. At the time I thought it was encouraging that he could admit and realize he had OCPD, but now he is in absolute denial and says he has it under control. That the problems all come from our "bad communication" skills.

My wife was diagnosed first by a neuro-psychiatrist after extensive testing with OCD. It was only after I did extensive research that I could bring OCPD to their attention, and now she is being treated for OCPD with medication and therapy.

Recently, the counselor brought up the concept of OCPD.  I later found out from the counselor that my husband wouldn't accept the diagnosis of OCPD, so the counselor took the "symptom approach," i.e. explaining to him how he was obsessive and compulsive. These he accepted. However, now that my husband has convinced himself that he doesn't have OCPD, he is very angry at me for having "imprisoned" him with this diagnosis of my own making for years. Not to mention, as far as I can tell, he's not working very hard on his "symptoms."

My girlfriend had a brain scan done and it was opposite of normal. The guy looked at her and said "how do you sleep at night?" She didn't. She knew something was up but she had no real interest in seeking a fix, something that might even help her feel better. Even her mom suggested getting help. Eventually she did go to therapy and it was about blaming everyone else. As soon as the therapist started scratching the surface she became too busy with work to go any more!!

Five years into the marriage, my husband was diagnosed with OCPD.  Constant conflict between wanting special concessions because "that is the way I am" and the continual denial that anything was wrong with him. This went on for another ten years, until I just could not stay in a war state of mind, all of the time.

Now after all this gloom and doom, is there any hope?  Yes, there is.  This is also a true story: 
I was formally diagnosed 10 years ago, and managed to completely dismiss and ignore it for many years.  My symptoms started to really get worse, to the point where I was making lists to organize my lists! I hated how I felt, was interested in feeling better, and came to learn techniques that addressed the OCPD without ever acknowledging the OCPD. It all comes down to acknowledging and taking responsibility for the chaos in your life, regardless of what the origin of that chaos is.
Having the official label of OCPD can help the partner to understand this is a mental disorder - that it is not us.  It may or may not be helpful to the person who has it.  If they would prefer to call themselves excessively perfectionistic, or "a little bit obsessive about some things," what matters is not whether they accept the label, but if they are willing to do the very hard work of battling the disorder.  


Photo via OIPA

As their loved ones, we need to understand our own boundaries, our own co-dependent tendencies to save the wounded birds.  It is entirely possible, once we stop enabling that they will feel the pain enough to take action about it.

One thing's for sure, nagging, reminding, and "helping," doesn't.

Got an experience with diagnosis and counseling you'd be willing to share? 
 
 

Comments (17)

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I don't know that OCPD (or any personality disorder for that matter) is that clearcut. I believe that there are many people with obsessive personality traits, as there are many people with narcissistic or histrionic personality traits. I think many of these individuals would function just fine without a relationship. Its only in the context of relationships that these traits become a major problem. I also think that people act diffferently in different relationships. Perhaps your ex would not have appeared so disordered with a different type of partner. I'm not saying that you are to blame in any way. I'm just saying that certain personality types just don't work well together. Some times it seems to me that the whole point of many of these self-help boards is for people to get validation that they are "normal", and it is their dysfunctional partner who is to blame for the deterioration of the relationship. Sometimes, two people just shouldn't be together. They make each other worse
2 replies · active 332 weeks ago
Thanks for your feedback, cb. It is altogether possible that my ex would have done better with a different partner, or a different approach, or, he might have done worse. He definitely WANTED a relationship though; he frequently expressed that he did "not want to die alone." I would be delighted if he found someone else to be with and had a good relationship with her.

Human beings ARE social animals; though some do BETTER alone than actively interacting with others, that's not to say they are functioning "just fine."

As I try to make clear here, and elsewhere on this blog, what we need to do is focus on our own Issues and becoming a mentally healthier person, instead of hoping that by saying The Right Thing or forcing our partners to go to The Right Doctor, that everything will be fixed and life will be rainbows and kittens.
Your comment seems defensive...no one is picking on anyone here...but when the person who might have it is affected in all relationships and with their own children and partners..then it is not as you describe ! When the person who has it wants real love so much and get its as they described they wanted it and still cannot handle everyday small things in life it only hurts them.
my ex has it bad...and doesn't see this in himself. I gave him everything he ever said he wanted, love support and so much more and I don't nag him... and he did love me a lot ...but his illness hurts him and everything he has in his life..even his son is hurt by it. My ex is a loving man and special to me but cannot handle even tiny things. His whole life is a struggle . Yes they think nothing is wrong with them and it is everyone else around them....they toss us away...but then show sign of loneliness, isolation etc... My ex does the same exact thing everyday of his life and if you try ( even his own son) wants to spend time with dad and do something..he cannot because his dad cannot break out of his routine for even a few hours or he gets anxiety over it. His son suffers and feel sad for not having his father but loves his father anyway ! This is not as you describe above at all ! I feel helpless watching my ex do this to himself....he has no friends, does unusual things, seems desperate at times..eve goes to the mother of his child's house and starts cleaning her home for no reason ! She knows he has it so she just lets him...he goes there cause he has no one else.. and no life he is lonely and desperate. But he is not attracted to his ex at all..and they have definitely been over for like 15 years ! But he hangs around at times cause he has no one and no place to go...his home has hardly any furniture or food in it...he lives strange..the guy think he is OK but clearly he is suffering inside over the OCPD. Your just so wrong ! If he was doing OK he would have his own life and love and not be desperately hanging around and cleaning his ex of 15 years home etc...I still love him and willing to deal with it and support him though ! I just do not pressure him...and he still has good qualities and can show love at times to me..he just goes in and out of things...but he does try hard ! Real love is loving in sickness and in heath ! That is how I feel !
Ha ha! I had to laugh because I think my OCPD husband did all four things.

Well, he wouldn't actually storm out of a session, at least that I know of, because that would waste his money. But he hates what the people say, and there's a storm waiting for me when he/we come out.

His diagnosing counselor wouldn't "label" him, just like you described. So he says I'm making up the diagnosis, and when I denied that, he said (in front of the diagnoser's boss, no less, who was then our counselor) that the guy didn't have any authority to diagnose anything.

After speaking with a church leader about how awful I was to be divorcing him, the leader told him that everyone makes choices and has to live with the consequences. DH apparently heard, and later conveyed the message to me that I was making dangerous choices and I was going to Hell for divorcing him. (He heard what he wanted to hear).

He says I found some disorder online and twisted things around to make it fit him (rejects the diagnosis). He's had two counselors throw up their hands because he refuses to do any of the work they ask him to do. One said, "I could help someone like him if he had even ONE OUNCE of insight and willingness." (rejects therapy)

And once, he said, "I don't deny that I sound just like those people (he was reading about OCPD). But I think that's the best way to be." He was proud of it. That sucked most of my hope right out of me.
1 reply · active 695 weeks ago
Susie - I am so sorry he can't/won't accept he needs help. At least you have the slim comfort of knowing you're not alone.

I visualize somebody sinking in quicksand, like n the movies, only instead of being willing to grab the rope or branch or climb on the board and get out of the hole, he is turning his back. Or perhaps, while sinking, criticizing the rescuer for offering the WRONG kind of rope.
I think I might have OCPD but im not quite sure. Also how do you know whats normal and what isnt ? I think nowadays everyone has an disorder how is that everbody is "not" normal. And we must not forget giving Therapy is still a BUSINESS withouth any "labeld sick individuals there would be no work out there for thearapist and there are a lot out there. Just to think about that makes it a little harder to get help.

How do I know this person is telling the truth and isnt simply trying to make money off of me with some fake diagonis. And EG medicine alter the state of your mind. It is a scary thing to let go of controll of your mind. People who sell Medicine are still in a businnes a multi million dollar business. It just sound sketchy to me to take something that can alter your state I never did alchol or drugs I just dont. So even the thought of approved drugs kind of scares me.

+ You are still responsible for your life when therapy doesnt work and srews up your routine you can only blame your self for alowing to hand over ownership of your life over to another human being.

Anyways I might consider getting help just because I know a guy I almost was in a relationship with and the difficulties that arised, the way in retrospect I saw I hurt him. Just makes me sad and anxious thinking about it.

And also the things he said about me and also other people that sound a bit like OCPD the only reason im consedering going to a therapist is because my life is a mess which is my own fault and im only 23 I should be enjoying my life in this age however looking back I was never satisfied even as a child nothing would live up to my standard and expectation of things. It is like everything is one big let down.

Also I have been seeing a thearapist for 5 + years on and off with my mother and other siblings. She never once used the term OCD. Eventhough I had trouble with being labeled etc. So how do I know if my thearapist is any good or I just have really high standards. I dont know what to do anymore.

Sorry for the long comment I am however greatfull for stumbling across your blog trough a link on children of hoarders if it wasnt for that link I would have probably never heard about OCPD
1 reply · active 670 weeks ago
Welcome Ann - quite all right about your reply, write as long as you like. :D

There are two self-tests you can take HERE: http://ocpd.freeforums.org/self-tests-f8.html that may give you an idea about whether you are really dealing with OCPD, or something else. If the tests indicate that you are, I encourage you to join that support board - lots of good people there also struggling to deal with having OCPD, or loving someone who does.

Therapists and meds - just like a mechanic, they can be GREAT, they can be okay and mostly get the job done, or they can "fix" a problem that doesn't exist, while totally missing another one that is the real source of the problem. That said, if your brakes were going out, or you car wouldn't accelerate on the freeway - and this car, by some strange law, was the ONLY car you could ever have for the rest of your life, you wouldn't stop looking until you found somebody who could fix it.

Sometimes we can solve our own problems by determination and willpower, but often, we need some outside help. You're right - therapy is a business, prescription drugs - a BIG business. Sometimes they are misapplied, but I know many people who have gained TREMENDOUS relief through a prescription drug regimen + therapy. Feeling like everything is one big let down - oh sweetheart, you deserve more than that. You DESERVE joy and excitement and satisfying love relationships - we ALL do. Please, don't let fear and uncertainty keep you from reaching for these things, from getting rid of whatever it is that is blocking you from experiencing them. {{{{hugs}}}}} and healing to you. <3 <3
I would so Love to see healing in my OCPD husband. He is 54 and I don't see any chance of him addressing this. It is so difficult to face the concept that we may have to separate. We have two young children. They adore their father as all children do, but the stress of his standards is starting to wear them down and they are starting to complain about him. I can see they are starting to walk on eggshells when he his home. I don't like seeing them live under this kind of stress and being so young. Thanks for all the info shared here.
1 reply · active 629 weeks ago
I think there are few situations more heartbreaking than a family where where one parent is OCPD, and *won't* get help, while the kids are hurting from the dysfunctional behavior.

Even though you love and have loyalty to your husband, you MUST put the kids first, if push comes to shove. Learn as much as you can about the disorder; see a counselor for yourself, and possibly get the kids in, but protect the kids.{{{{hugs}}}} and healing to you and your family. <3
Bewildered's avatar

Bewildered · 619 weeks ago

My premise of a healthy relationship is allowing each individual to maintain their individuality and for the partnership of two to be strengthened due to the positive qualities that each can bring. Sadly, when one of the two individuals has a personality disorder, the whole is affected negatively, particularly where one of the party recognises where the problems exist and the other is in total denial as to what the problem is. I believe my partner has OCPD with strong Narc. traits - and living with him has tested my own sanity (and health) to the extreme. You can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it drink... without professional help he will never change / never get better has he cannot do it by himself and I refuse to stay in such an unhealthy, dysfunctional relationship where I/the children have to change the way we do things in order to pander to (and therefore enable) his dysfunctional ways. I have empathy for him, however, he appears to be unaffected by his dysfunctional way of doing things, yet the rest of us feel we need straitjackets!
1 reply · active 619 weeks ago
There are similarities in this with alcoholism/abuse - sometimes the person has to lose EVERYTHING, to "bottom out" before s/he can realize, "It's not them, it's ME."

There is absolutely no way you can trick or persuade or coax someone into changing if they don't see any need to change.
Nothern_Guy's avatar

Nothern_Guy · 582 weeks ago

I ruled out OCD because although my mom has it (and OCPD) I overcame my OCD-like tendencies when I got into my teens. All my adult life I have struggled with anxiety, depression, codependency, hypochondriasis, relationship problems, vocational problems and social impairment (few friends, few hobbies). I don't travel or go anywhere - it seems all I like to do is make lists of things that need to be done (at home and at work) and feel better as things are crossed off. I obsses about things but am not obsessively clean - i make piles of important documents like a hoarder and lose important documents. This problem (and it's exhaustive need for control) has cost me big this time, my marriage is over and we have two kids together. Vocationally, my job is a dead-end joke and my employer even gloats about how dependent I am on him. It's pathetic. Now, alone and wide awake and facing this problem, I feel very tired and defeated. I don't know where to start setting goals because I don't really want anything. It's like being alive and dead at the same time.
2 replies · active 562 weeks ago
from Julie (posted below, reposted here: Maybe you should see someone about why you are having such trouble letting go of a toxic, fairly short-term relationship, why you are torturing yourself over this.
Nothern Guy - please, go see a doctor or psychiatrist, who may be able to prescribe a medication that helps with that feeling of defeat and tiredness. While you may be able to address other issues, you may have something going on physically that is adding to the burden you are carrying.

There's no pill that can cure you, but sometimes medication can lift the load enough, for long enough, to break old bad habits or form good new ones. Hugs and healing to you.
Julia Naraine 's avatar

Julia Naraine · 567 weeks ago

I have OCPD and I know I would be a nightmare to live with for many folks! I am so fortunate to a have a wonderful & loving Husband who loves and accepts me for who I am warts and all & who never makes me feel bad for being the way I am. He has his own struggles, so we are the two misfits together!

I am fortunate because I can see myself from an outside perspective and I know how weird my ways are for many people and how unreasonable I am if others try to interfere with the way I think something needs to be done, so I generally try to avoid those situations as I hate to upset others.

My family, particularly my Stepfather have always thought me peculiar since I was a child and made no bones about vocalising this, so I have grown up with a deep dislike and inability to accept myself, which in turn I think, makes the need for order worse.

What is often not acknowledged in articles about OCPD is the terrible despair, panic, anxiety, self loathing and anguish the sufferer feels on a daily basis and how incredibly hard it is to achieve even the smallest of tasks at times. I wish with all my heart I was not this way & every day I try to think & feel differently & do things differently, but at nearly 50 the progress is slow and sometimes I think I am losing my grip on everything. If it wasn't for my husband I would be a near recluse for sure.

Wishing well to everyone who reads this & never give up hope or trying!
1 reply · active 562 weeks ago
Julia, thanks so much for your reply here. Yes, the person with OCPD (who is self-aware) is truly suffering. Please keep on fighting the good fight... everything I have read suggests it IS possible to at least partially "rewire" the brain although it takes significant effort and extreme mindfulness to avoid slipping into old, comfortable patterns.
Julia Naraine's avatar

Julia Naraine · 567 weeks ago

p.s.....to Nothern_Guy, I completely get where you are coming from, but please try not to give up hope, sometimes it gets very dark, but I hope you find something that can bring you joy, even if it's really small :-)

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